Young men have an in-born passion to take control of the reins of their destiny. They need to earn their money, balance their own spread-sheet of expenditures, learn to make choices – before they are sent off to college, responsible for a $10,000+ investment. Too many young men fail because of responsibility in-experience
What made boys turn into men like Henry Ford, John D Rockerfeller, Thomas Edison, Andrew Carnegie and Audie Murphy?
Are child-labor laws that discourage most companies from under-18 hiring partially to blame? Think about it – if young men can’t start working until 18, it makes sense that they won’t leave the nest until 25. If they start working at 14, how many young men would be better equipped to make a fairly graceful leap out of the nest at high school graduation?
Yes, there is something to be said for giving our children what we didnt’ have . I don’t think being unprepared for independence at 18 is one of those things we meant to give.
I remember the reporting for the Columbine shooting, media personalities referring to high school students as children. They tried the same thing with the Virginia Tech shooting, referring to college students as children, but I guess when there were graduate students and teachers shot, they withdrew “children” from reports.
My college students even referred to themselves as “kids” in their writing, the same kids who probably railed at home for independence and claims of manhood. Because we were studying how to write a detail definition paragraph (dictionary definition, synonyms and personal definition), we discussed this concept of 18, 19 and 20 year olds considering themselves “kids.”
“‘Cause I can’t take care of myself,” the young man reasoned. A lot of heads bobbed up and down in agreement. My inside-my-head conversation replied silently, “Can’t take care of yourself according to the fashion to which you’ve become accustomed, you mean.”
“The Children. The Children. We’re doing this all for the children” is the mantra we hear from kindergarten PTOs to even high school personnel. How can one feel like an adult when they are continually being put in the position of a child?
Our oldest son had to save up a year’s worth of rent before he could move out. When he did move out, he did so with confidence. We told him we would help him with food, but only once a semester did we go grocery shopping – for an average of $100. He never had to buy food because he told friends, “You bring it. I’ll cook it.”
One of my sons railed at the world, wanting to be on his own, “I’m an adult. I can take care of myself.” Because we were his money source, we were the ones holding him down, limiting what he could do. He hated asking us for money – or working for us to earn that money.
Then he got a job, after he turned 18 – the magical age of hiring. The pressure in our relationship evaporated. He started managing his money. He discovered discretionary spending.
Years of frustrating, arguments and anger would have been alleviated if the job market had been more “youth” friendly – like it was when I was a young adult.
Child labor laws prevent farmers from hiring teens. One farmer told me it just was not worth the risk of a government official breathing down his back. I thought a summer of bailing hay would give my son a hunger for an education.
In our community, it is difficult for young men to hired because they are not 18.
Adulthood delayed = stunted growth, delayed maturity.
Young men not working are like runners who do not run. They have no opportunity to learn how to work for someone else, come under the authority of someone not their parent, become adept at discerning and implementing necessary skill sets. No learning how to be diplomatic, to bite their tongue and keep their words behind their teeth. No learning now to organize their life into categories: work, rest and “my” time – because it takes time to learn that living is about giving up “my” time – and balancing, finding “my” in work. If young men do not learn how to take care of themselves before they leave the nest – then how will they be successful? Full of Confidence? Bravado?
“Independence with Training Wheels” is how my son defined our method.
It started at age 13. When each son turned 13, they got the talk. This is how it went: “According to Judeo-Christian values, you are a man now. The world wants to call you children, but today you are a man. You are responsible for your soul. That means God knows you are able to tell right from wrong, you are responsible for the condition of your soul, whether you are bound for heaven or hell.”
Then I go further, telling them that over 100 years ago, if their dad died, they would be considered the man of the house, responsible for hunting for food, providing for the family. Davy Crockett knew how to hunt for food at their age. Paul Revere was already apprenticed. One historical account had George Washington, at age 11, helping his mother manage their farm after his father’s death.
Young men have an in-born passion to take control of the reins of their destiny. They need to earn their money, balance their own spread-sheet of expenditures, learn to make choices – before they are sent off to college, responsible for a $10,000+ investment. Too many young men fail because of responsibility in-experience.
Charlie Nolan at St. Clara University said, “”Young women, they mature earlier. They get a better sense for how to negotiate life — particularly academic life, time management. They are very good at that, and it’s reflected in their applications.”
As a mother of sons, I beg to differ. Young women in today’s culture have very different opportunities. They babysit. One matures earlier when given activities that build maturity. As a result, young men would have a “better sense to negotiate life.” Academic need would become real because they would have their own personal experience to make that decision, instead of just being “told” it will. Young men with experience – well, colleges will find it “reflected in their applications.”
Sadly, this attitude is reflected in our churches as well. While young women (12+) volunteer in church child-care, boys and men are shooed away unless accompanied by a woman. Why? Well, silly, don’t you know? Men are more likely to be molesters? One teenage son was distraught when the youth minister told the young women in youth not to trust the young men. How can America, or even our churches, expect our young men to be a great treasure when they are treated like criminals who need to be contained? Restricted? Untrusted?
Parents would have fewer challenges, Schools would have few fights, and Colleges would have few drop-outs if young men were allowed to start being men when they are 12. That means jobs at age 12/13, even if it is dusting shelves. That means expecting the best out of our young men – and in expecting our best, giving them the opportunities to do their best outside of school.
Then maybe “Being a Man” choices would be something more than sex, drugs and alcohol choices. Maybe there would be fewer young men as high-school drop-outs. Maybe the retention rate for men in universities would increase. Maybe, just maybe, our sons would soar more often.
Great article. I’ve often wondered why only the teenage girls are asked to watch the children when the woman’s group meets at church.
I don’t balk at asking teenage boys to watch my boys, though I do have to be very comfortable with the parents, trust them, and then know the boy first…but I am the same way with girls.
Thanks for the insight.
It has torn my heart to see that early on boys are considered the “bad guys” due to somebody’s statistics. It bothers me even more when moms of daughters-only look at young men as evil threats to their daughters. Moms have openly talked about that with me. I do not even think they realize what they are saying. I guess I would look at it differently. I would talk about the kind of young men they should look for and why, but I would also discuss the kind of young men they should avoid. I would not lump them all together as “threats” to their daughters.
Thanks for coming by!
Oh I would love to give you a big hug for this post. Love it. So many parts.
My 16 year old has been busy applying for jobs all over town with no luck. While there are jobs for 16 year olds here he has been more interested in jobs that would typically go to college students. Coffee houses, restaurants, movie theater. I told him yesterday to just go apply to Target where he has friends that work and get on with it! He needs to work, he has done a temp position in the summers at a fair and I see a maturity during those weeks I would love to see more of. Plus we need him to make money!
And I think often about how much easier it is for a girl to make money. But for the same reasons that some people fear letting a boy babysit, I fear letting him babysit. I don’t want him put in a possision of a false acusation, in our culture it is guilty til proven innocent in those cases. So we foot the bill and we do struggle to get him to understand the responsibility of adulthood.
And I also told him recently that he would need to save a year of rent before we would let him get an apartment while in college. So nice to know I am not alone in that plan.
And although you didn’t specifically touch on it I think a lot about how our culture has created generations of bored teenagers, adults with no responsibilities and the problems that arise because of it.
Oh and I loved the part where you said the kids couldn’t take care of themselves in the manner they had become accustom. So true, such a problem.
Great post. Thanks.
We think so much alike that it could almost be a Scary-Mommy thing! LOL. Bored teens = high school drop outs, low grades, and behavior problems in the classroom. If they were allowed to work early, they would understand what that high school education meant. “Because I told you so” is so empty. Boys need hands-on experience to develop need-concepts!
Thanks so much for adding awesome insight into the discussion!
This definitely struck a chord because my husband often argues the exact same thing.
My question is “Do you argue the same thing?” Just curious! Maybe if I had girls, I would see things differently. I remember being at a soccer game when the oldest was in 2nd grade. A little girl was about to pass him on the field, and before I knew what I was doing, I hollered, “Don’t you let that girl pass you!!!” I was stunned! I couldn’t believe such a sexist comment came out of my mouth – and that I was pulling for the boy. I guess we become Mama Grizzlies over the needs of our cubs, and when that need is to raise responsible young men – well you take stands you never imagined, hanging out with your girl peeps before you married.
Thanks for stopping by!
Thank you for this post! I’m sharing it with my hubby. 🙂
I was actually able to get a part-time job at 15 at a local Burger King. I think Publix (a Florida supermarket chain) hires for grocery baggers at 14. Maybe your state has stricter laws?
We’ll definitely have our boys find a part-time job at an early age.
Great post!
It is much more difficult now to find a job U-16. One son works at a Christian camp during the summer for free. One has been trying to get a job since November. He’s avoided fast food because they ntend to put boys in the kitchen, which is really awful on your skin, especially if you have acne problems. Right now, every place he’s applied wants college students, with college student hours. He’ll graduate in June (thanks snow days). The job environment is definitely not what it was in the 70s and 80s. I think June will open a lot of doors for him. Keep him in your prayers!
I have been following your blog for a couple of weeks now and have enjoyed it VERY MUCH! I love the way you write, what you write and all the wisdom you posses, gain and share with us all.
As a mother of 4 sons I am in total agreement with your post. My sons are still little. 9, 7, 4 and 2, but they already work a lot around the house, by most people’s standards anyway. But that’s ok, I’m not lead by their standards but by what the Lord shows me is best for my family. The boys seems to be doing just fine :o)
Thank you again and keep them coming!
Blessings,
Linda
Linda,
So glad you decided to stop by and not only read but add to the discussion. A mother of 4! I so know how you feel! My 10 year old has just moved out of the phase where he LOVED to help. I remember when he loved to help do the dishes. LOL. Then they start evasive maneurvering to get OUT of working (around 10). That’s where an allowance comes in handy. No job completion without whining – No allowance. I love how God leads us to raise these boys to men. I would not want to do this without him.
That was very interesting, thanks! 🙂 Here the legal age from which you are allowed to earn money is 13. There are babysitting classes available and advertised in schools for kids from that age. Boys and girls. In our church, boys and girls from that age teach the small Sunday school class (age 4-8, roughly) and look after the nursery class, usually with an adult present. Sometimes even a male adult! *grin* More of the boys show an interest in the 4-8 year olds – any thoughts on why that would be?
But Swiss society is very traditional in many ways so it’s probably not surprising that some stuff here is still how it was in your childhood. We still have a three (possibly more) tier education system, with grammar schools, normal schools and apprenticeships. As far as I can tell, all three are considered to be of equal value. You only need to go to grammar school if you want to go on to university here. But you’re not a lesser person if you “only” finished high school, or “only” did an apprenticeship.
My parents gave us girls our allowance in the form of a “bank account”, on paper in a box in the kitchen. If we wanted cash, we had to ask to withdraw it (from my mother!) and write it down in the box – debit and running total. We were usually not allowed to go overdrawn, unless it was for something that they agreed we needed now and were going to be able to pay back within a couple of weeks. If we earned money we could keep it or we could hand it over and write it down in the box. After Christmas they would usually start up a separate list for saving up for the summer holidays, and we would put part of our allowance in there. So we knew how to handle money quite early on. When we left home my dad taught us to run a budget, and I still use the system he showed me today, 14 years later. It’s a surprising amount of fun! 🙂
I wonder if your son would consider teaching English as a part-time job? I bet there are immigrant kids in your town who could use conversation lessons or new families with small kids who would like to spend a few hours learning basics like numbers, colours, etc. We all taught English at one time or another, from age 16 I guess, as well as babysitting and working for a friend who sold tie-dyed T-shirts! None of us had an official long-term job like a postal round, we just found jobs among friends and neighbours.
(Having said all that, I thought child labor laws in the US allowed teens to work from 14? Or does it vary from state to state?)
Mika!
I’ve missed you!!!! I knew you would add something wonderful to the discussion! I LOVE your kitchen bank account. You will do a post on that won’t you? I really think you should. I think the problem with the Child Labor Laws make farmers less comfortable hiring young men due to the risk involved. While it is there to protect the young workers, it also puts a greater burden on the farmer. They’d just rather not get involved.
I think boys love 4 to 8 year olds so much because they do not try to Alpha Dog the teens. 4 to 8 year olds are refreshingly honest, have that awesome humor, or need to be drawn out. They don’t try to challenge the Alpha Dog of the pack, but have more of a hero worship. Because theses 4 to 8 year olds do not threaten the teens “position” in the pack, they tend to be more protective, nuturing, patient. And when one drives them nuts, they are more likely to be exasperated, not angry.
So glad you came Mika! You always add something meaty to the discussion!!
So true about the hero worship! Froglet reckons one of the teens who does Sunday School is his “friend”… not sure the lad in question feels the same but it is cute!
I had a question for you – vaguely related – what age do you think is good for giving a boy his first knife? We thought maybe when he starts proper school at age 7? They sell them from age 5 here but, given how many bumps and bruises he gives himself already, we’re not entirely convinced!
You are so right on the money with this post!
I was always handed everything from my parents and, while I know they had good intentions, life has shown me that they did me no favors with that behavior.
Thanks for some great reading!
I think it is a blessing to be able to provide a warm, secure home with both parents by you every step of the way, helping make your dreams a reality. We realized early on that it was important to make our children “want” – and by that I mean not give them the best cars (I’ll have to do a post on that), no tvs in their room, no financial freedom to make any purchase they wanted. Usually, they had to work around the house to earn it. With 5 boys, there’s plenty of work. I must admit, the effect of that “wanting” has had different responses from different children. “Team player,” “easily-coachable” children just get with it. Less “coachable” youth definitely balk and rail.
THanks for stopping by melissa and furthering the discussion:)
Preach it! I was working as soon as I could. I managed to buy my car and my own computer from many summers of babysitting and odd jobs!
AHhhhhh, but there you prove my point. You had babysitting jobs! I never realized what boys are up against until I had sons. Kudos for buying your own car and your own computer. One of our sons is restoring a 1972 truck with his own money. He has been sanding and using bondo on it for a year. It’s about ready for the paint job. We are so excited for him.
Wonderful article and very defining in what it “really” means to raise a son(s).
Raising sons to be men starts when they learn to walk. When I look at my sons, I see the child they were – but I so have to focus on the man they are, even at 12/13. I have to step back and give them that “independence on training wheels” so that when they leave the nest, they soar. Age 12+ is a down and dirty time in many ways – because as a mom you are no longer on the pedestal. They know you don’t have all the answers. They want independence, 4th of July style, but don’t realize that battles, disappointment and want led up to that independence – and only through perserverance was it gained. Thanks for stopping by Lee:)
Wonderful article!! I read an article several years ago about this phase of adolescents. Then we had a child in our home that defied all rules, and as hubs tried to give him more independence and responsibility with it, we ran into the not 18 walls that abound in society. Even the bank my husband banks with would not give him a checking account. We ran into another problem with his mom who he could play like a fiddle. So now he, at almost 21, and his sister at 23, have limited financial responsibility b/c they know how to get the important stuff handled so they can continue to play.
So, having watched this, when my oldest turned 16, and his dad gave him an older car (1993 model) I insisted that son pay for his insurance (on his dad’s, but he pays). He pays his own gas too. It has gone well, but society puts pressure on him and on us. It is hard when the majority of teens do not have to even pay for their gas, let alone any portion of a payment or insurance. On the other hand, he has taken better care of his car than other I have seen. I still had an account at different bank than hubs and they let him set up a checking/bank account. I did not let him have the debit card for 6 month though.
My 14 yr. old, the one the money burns holes in his pockets, mows lawns for a few people and I have made him by his more fivolous wants. He has tried to thow that back at me lately, but I KNOW he will have no idea the value of money if he doesn’t feel the discomfort of his choices when the $$ is gone and he has another “want”
I am amazed at the number of early 20’s still at home, and many not because they can’t make it on their own, they can’t because they would have to forfeit the childish part of life they insist they should hold on to. What? pay rent? pay utilities? I can’t, I have a party I have to help fund, what about my nails? etc.
AND, I think this has struck and stunned many a parent that was not watching where this was heading. A baffled bunch of parents that should be adjusting to the empty nest, not stuck in the state of anticipation.
Lailani,
It amazes me the way different children handle money differently. Our second one definitely that “money-burns-holes-in-his-pockets” response, while the oldest probably has his first dime. We play car insurance and one tank of gas (for school) a week. Anything else he needs to pay for. It was funny how you said abotu your 14 year old – “he has tried to throw that one back at me lately.” I could do a whole post on that one – it amazes me how differently each child sees the story unfolding in a house and their take on it. Thanks for joining the discussion!
Maryleigh
I so want JDaniel to grow up a whole man with life experiences that have helped him develop life skills.
What an interesting topic! I’m a mother of two boys. 12 & 6. When I was 12 I babysat regularly for severla familes. my son would never do such a thing. Hmmm…I think he wouldn’t be able to handle that responsibility. You post has me thinking otherwise. Excellent!
I always love hearing your thoughts on raising boys into responsible men. Too many people blow it off as “boys will be boys.”
But, those are not the kind of comments that are helpful to me.
So, I appreciate the thought you put into your posts. 🙂
You have certainly given me something to think about. As the mom of both a girl and a boy, I can see the unfairness you talk about. however, i have already told my son he has a year or two more of practice on our yard and his grandpa’s yard, then he had better round up some more and earn his keep. 🙂
At age eleven, we haven’t got there yet although I already look around me and imagine how I want to be as a mother of teens and the life lessons I want to pass on. I think might be tough but with forethought and some creativity, I hope we can offer our boys the chance to mature appropriately.
Great post, It really makes you stop and think. I’ve never thought about it but it’s true there are only girls that watch the boys for Sunday school. We did have a father do it but it was for early service were it was mostly just his kids and my boys.
Thanks for stopping by! I’m so the same way I moved and now will travel to my hair dresser 🙂
Great post. I don’t have any kids yet, but I work with a college ministry and I can tell you, something has indeed happened to men in our culture in the past 10 or so years. I graduated from High School 12 years ago, but when I was in HS, young men were given jobs at age 16 and sometimes 15. So many young men are graduating from college never having a job! And they are moving back home with Mommy and Daddy trying to “find themselves.” It’s disturbing.
A most excellent post! This was GOOD! My brother hauled hay at 15-17 (high school years); I was 15 with my first part-time after school job; hubby was 14 or 15. My 28 yr olf son got his first “outside” job at 16, part time his Jr/Sr year but he’d been working for his dad, learning the responsibility of doing a good job. I can say this for sure: my son is an incredibly hard worker who is a dedicated and faithful employee (even if he hates the job). In a world where most workers are slackers, this is saying a lot.
This article was very eye-opening (those pictures!) but it is also something that didn’t used to need to be said – it was taken as a given. How far we’ve come in life where children are coddled up to the age of 30 and past.
And to lighten up a serious subject: so George Washington’s father was 11 when he died? Sorry, I couldn’t help it!! I quote, “…manage their farm after his father’s death at age 11.” Heh heh heh.
I always need a good editor! I’d like to say that I knowingly leave at least one mistake to keep me humble – but I don’t even have to try. LOL
I don’t even write whole complete sentences anymore and apparently can’t write without a ton of dashes – know what I mean??
Great post! I remember thinking it was nuts when I heard a 30 year old guy being referred to as a kid… I mean seriously.. you can get youth flights i think now for up to 30 years.. it’s crazy… anyhow! Preach it on sistah! LOL.
Great article. I have a teenage nephew who raises sheep. It started as a 4H project, but now, while he still does 4H, it is more of a (serious) hobby for him. It’s what he wants to do when he “grows up.” He lives and breaths sheep. His sisters and others think he’s weird, but I have often wondered how much better off he would be if it was allowable for him to ditch school and focus on sheep-raising and other ranching activities full-time. I am sure he would be happier and learn at least as much. He is already more responsible, more grown-up in a lot of ways, than most his age.
I hope when my boys are that age I can remember this, and hopefully we can find them meaningful things to do.
Ok, in reading this article, the first thing I think is how can we change this for our boys. My oldest just turned 12 in January. I feel and believe the same that we should treat him as young man, give him responisbility, jobs, and money to manage. My question is how? It seems he is bucking our guidance. I must admit my frustration.
Praying for guidance and wisdom.
Dani Joy
I agree with so much of what you have said. They will live up to or down to our expectations usually, we should choose up whenever we can.
I agree strongly with your post. I love seeing my young man being excited about the odd jobs he’s had this summer. Even though he applied for many jobs, and no one hired, he has busied himself with finding little odd jobs that he can do for people here and there. He takes pride in those achievements, as he should! I love it that I haven’t had to nag at him to do this, as well. Praying my young man cub will grow up into being a responsible man, and working hard to affirm him on this journey.
This is such a great post. We have our 4 year old learning about saving money already! I think one failure of many parents in our culture is not teaching their children about money management and giving them hands-on experience with it. I love that when he wants something, it’s, “I want to save my money for X,” rather than, “I want X,” or “Can I have X for my birthday?” He has even talked about saving his money to buy a car… a real car… like one he sees that he likes when driving down the road… LOL!
I wonder how feasible it is to help sons find “jobs” … more like starting kind of a little business doing yard work for neighbors or walking pets or something like that….
My 15-year-old daughter wants a job so bad, but nobody hires that young. I know I was working part-time at 15. I don’t know who changed the rules, but most of the above goes for girls too. If they could get a job early on, they would get into less trouble.
I completely agree and LOVE LOVE LOVE hearing someone put it into such an understandable and loving way.
Our kids will never soar if we don’t put expectations on them that push them to bring out the best they have within themselves.
Great Great post 🙂
Stopping by from SITS!
AMEN AMEN AMEN! You are SO on target with this post! In our agriculture community, it’s expected children/young adults begin work at an early age. In fact, it’s **necessary**. Our (and I use the word lightly) government just tried to pass a law/regulation saying “children” couldn’t work on the farm…even chores! That’s so beyond stupid but par for the course for “our” government.
“A workman is worth his hire” no matter his or her age.
Many thanks for stopping by Thistle Cove Farm, come back soon!
Dear Maryleigh,
Would you be willing to share this post and be a guest blogger (as is Thistle Cove Farm) on our website http://www.livingbetterat50.com? Please email me at prudencelay@gmail.com. We would love to publish this for Mother’s Day and have you be a guest blogger for us. Blessings to you and your family.
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This is SO good! And I think ever so true. If only more people understood this and it our society could be turned around in this matter.
This is AWESOME!!!! Thank you on so many levels. Our children are still young. (Our son 2) My husband & i have often struggled with laws that are being passed for the same reasons you wrote about. We’ve even discussed “how are we supposed to raise responsible adults if laws keep them from experiencing real life”. We have no intentions of just handing things to them, but rather encouraging growth & maturity. I’d much rather have them experience some hard lessons of discretion, management & saving, or experience failure under my roof than throw them out to the wolves, so to speak. Great wisdom!
MaryLeigh … your writing is good for me since I had no brothers or sons. But there are sons-in-law now, and a grandson, too. Thanks for helping me go into their world with a deeper understanding.
Appreciating you …
Hi Mary Leigh! I had a boy and a girl, so I’ve seen both sides of this discussion. My son must have been different, because he did babysit and cut lawns before he was sixteen (teens can be employed at 16 in my state). But I will say that his job outlook was much narrower than my daughter’s.
I think employers tend to hire girls over boys because they think that they are more steady, more serious. It’s certainly not fair. My son had to scramble for jobs in the last years of high school, at one point painting houses.
There’s no question that he had a harder time learning to budget than my daughter. Your post reminds me of all the ‘discussions’ we had over purchases he couldn’t afford. It is a longer road, no question.
Very thoughtful post. And many have related to it too!
Ceil
Great post. As a mom to three boys, we definitely have had our share of trying to find jobs for the older boys when they were in their teen years, but helping with yard work and other odd jobs at church during the summer got them the idea of putting in a full day of labor. My youngest is ten, and will work to build independence in him as well.
It starts early like expecting them to talk with the waiter and other adults in service industries. Plus not solving every problem for them. I liked the idea of growing up with training wheels.
When we’ve traveled by air, we’ve walked off the plane and I’ve said, “Ok, what do we need to do now to make our connection.” He’s working towards being able to fly on his own to visit his oldest brother.